Episode 7
Olwyn Jones

Georgie: Welcome to ‘With Love from Bougainvillea’, a podcast hosted by your very own local students today, being Georgie and Eva. Hi, I'm Georgie, and I'm running music as well as interviewing our guests.
Zara: Hi, I'm Zara, and I'm also interviewing our guests.
Eva: Hi, I'm Eva, and I do all the creative works for our covers as well as interviewing our guests.
Shyan: Hi, I'm Shyan and I'm in charge of all the tech, edits and our website.
Zara: The aim of this podcast, ‘With Love from Bougainvillea’, is to capture the lives and wisdom of the residents here at the Bougainvillea Retirement Village. As young people, this is an incredible opportunity to connect with and learn from other, older members of the community. Our goal is to provide advice for a younger audience in an accessible and entertaining manner. Creating a podcast means that for the average working student, they can listen and simultaneously juggle their busy schedule.
Georgie: Today we are joined by a woman by the name of Olwyn Jones. A second-language English teacher, Olwyn has a deep appreciation for language, culture and storytelling. A passionate reader, she’s currently drawn to mystery and crime novels, and on top of all that, she’s an author herself, and currently in the process of writing her own autobiography.

Owlyn: Owlyn Gene Jones. I was born on the 28th of October, 1930. So that makes me 94.
Georgie: Wow. 
Owlyn: Now that's difficult. Because my father died when I was five. I don't think you know who Shirley Temple was. 
Georgie: I’ve definitely heard of the name.
Owlyn: Yes, she had curly hair and she danced. And I had curly hair and I danced. 
Georgie: Dancing!
Owlyn: But I had to give up dancing because my mother just couldn't afford for me to go on dancing. So, who did I look up to? Might have been someone in a book because I was a real reader. I read and read and read every possible book that you could possibly think of. So much so, that my mother, you would say, “Owlyn, set the table, please.” “Yes, Mum. I’ll just finish this page.” About 3 pages later, she'd say, "Owlyn, set the table.” So... No, I don't think… Unless it was one of the school teachers that I had when I was in primary school. Her name was Miss Rose and she was absolutely gorgeous. And I think she inspired me to be a teacher. I got a scholarship to go to high school. And from high school, I got a scholarship to go to teachers' college. Because we just couldn't afford it on my stepfather's salary. So it's really been my journey all the way through. I had to depend on myself a lot. My mother was not well educated. She left school when she was 13 and my stepfather, who was a lovely man, didn't take much interest in my education. So it was up to me. So I came out of teacher's college. In those days, they used to pay us to go to college. Um, And I taught in Sydney at a place called Padstow Park, which is over on the South Side, Revesby, Padstow Park, Picnic Point, like that. I taught there for 12 months. And then I was sent to Cowra Migrant Camp. Now, this was 1951- they were bringing refugees out from Europe, and they had- were in a camp, and I was one of the teachers in the school there. And as well as teaching the children a primary education, I also had to teach them English. So I became quite proficient in teaching English. I was only there 12 months and then I got a message to say, “Go to Newcastle, ASAP,” and I was sent to the Junction Demonstration School, which was a school that teachers college sent the students down to us, and we would give a lesson, and the students would sit in on the lessons- that was very interesting. In the meantime, I met and married. And so I took time off to have my children. I had 3 children, and I took time off until my youngest one was ready to go to school. Then I went back teaching, and I was sent to an infant school. And the infant's mistress said, “Oh, your primary trained. Oh. Well, we'll just have to put up with that, won't we?” So I was there-
Georgie: Oh, that's not very nice. Goodness gracious.
Olwyn: She was, she was a spinster, teaching was her life. She had no other interests. Um-
Georgie: Can I ask you a question? How was it getting back into the workforce from taking time off?
Olwyn: Oh, no difficulty whatsoever. The minute I said I wanted to go back teaching, I had a job. Because this was 19-, I've got to stop and think. 1965, and teachers were- they were short of teachers. So it was very easy to get back into the workforce. I spent 12 um 6 months with this mistress. The end of the year, an email came round to the staff, and said “To the staff and Mrs. Jones, parents would like to have you for morning tea.” Now, I didn't like being called the staff and Mrs. Jones. I was a member of the staff. So I went up to her and I said, “Miss Windross, how long do you have to be here to be a member of the staff?” And she looked at me and she said, “Why?” and I said, “well, look at this email.” “Oh,” she said, “I'm sorry about that.” Thereafter I was part of the staff. 
Georgie: Oh, that's so good. 
Olwyn: You had to confront her because when I took over the class, it was 1st class. And she said to me “Now, all these children can read.” So horrible Mrs. Jones, they had books. I don't know if you remembered going through infant school, but they had books and there was a picture and then the story was underneath it. When I covered up the picture. The children didn't have a clue what was on the page. They had just learned it by rote. Oh, sitting in a classroom, looking at the picture, telling the story, and I went up to Mrs- Miss Windrust, and I said, none of these children can read. She said, “What do you mean? They can all read.” I said, “Well, let me show you.” So, I took her down. Can the children come out one at a time? Horrible, Mrs. Jones, covered up the picture, and the children didn't have a clue. “Oh,” she said, oh, oh. However, by the end of that year, every one of those children could read. 
Eva: Wow. 
Olwyn: Because I had a method. I don't know how you learned to read. But I taught them... I taught them phonics. Per. is a phonic. Oh, is a phonic. And they would look at the word and they would go through it. B-oi, boy. Good, and we'd learn IRL says, uh, girl. And that's how I taught them to read. And every one of those children could read at the end of the year. Fortunately for me, Miss Windross got a move and I was had, I had a delightful person, as the next interest. But I wasn't there all that long. And I was applied for a primary class and went to a place called Hamilton in Newcastle. And at the time, the BHP were recruiting men from overseas because they needed labour and they couldn't get it from the Australians. So where they were bringing Europeans out from, well, it's now called Yugoslavia. But it was Macedonia, Serbia, and Croatia. And the families would come out. Children would arrive at the school on Monday without a word of English. And so my mistress of the primary school said, oh, when you've had experience in this, take over the English class. So I taught them English and that became my forte. I became the English as a 2nd language teacher. I had to write my own programs because the government hadn't quite caught up with us and I became known as the expert in Newcastle. And when I gave up teaching, I had enough. The director of education ran me and said, “Olwyn, would you consider coming back 3 days a week and being our consultant?” So I taught the teachers. I had an absolutely wonderful time. 
Georgie: Wow. 
Olwyn: All over the Hunter Valley. If the child arrived with no English, they'd ring me up and I'd go by this time the government had caught up and they provided books and materials and I would go with a boot full of materials and teach the teacher how to- how to look after the classes. That’s how I finished up my teaching career. 
Georgie: Did you have any cultural clashes with the new kids coming into Australia? Did you have any cultural things that you learnt from them maybe?
Olwyn: Yes and no. The um, the parents would uh, invite me to their places and we'd have afternoon tea. I'd meet the mothers and fathers. Didn't really matter to me what nationality they were. They were all lovely people who wanted their children to learn. There was one particular family. They were Korean, and I happened to mention that I was going to Korea in the school holidays. So I was invited out to their place for dinner one night and they requested that I take a package to career and I wanted to know what was in the package, of course. And it was makeup. You know, just ordinary makeup that you could buy here in Australia, but they couldn't get it in Korea. So anyway, when we were over there, this car pulled up at the hotel and this gentleman came and got us. He was the man of the house, but he looked like a chauffeur. Anyway, he drove it to the house and we were fated by delightful Korean family. We had the evening meal with them in Korea, you sit on the floor- on cushions, and they were just such a lovely family, and that gave us an insight into how people actually lived in Korea. That was a highlight of the trip that we did. What else? I gave up teaching, and I did some more travelling. 
Eva: You did a lot of travelling. 
Olwyn: I’ve done a lot of travelling. 
Eva: Do you want to say where you've been? You were telling me earlier, but... 
Olwyn: Yes, I... Well, 1st of all, I did a lot of travelling in Australia. I did the red centre. I did the Kimberly toured from Darwin down to Perth, I travelled out the east coast of Australia to Cape York. Oh, from Perth, I did the Indian Pacific train back to Sydney. I've done the Kimberley cruise from Broom to Darwin by sea. I've been to Tasmania. I've done the Gan trip from Darwin down to Adelaide, and then across the southern, the, what do they call it? The Great South Road, from Adelaide to Melbourne. I think I've been everywhere.
Georgie: Maybe it would be quicker to name things where you haven't been! 
Eva: She did, actually. She started telling me where she hadn't been.
Olwyn: I haven't been to South America and I haven't been to South Africa. But I've been all over Europe. I've driven around England and Scotland. 
Georgie: Wow. 
Olwyn: I've done the Baltic tour, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Russia. Where else have I been? Oh, Canada, and the inside passage up to Alaska, just about all over America, where else have I been? I've been to Thailand, Japan, Korea. I haven't been to India, but then I had no real wish to go to India. 
Eva: You said Russia as well, didn't you?
Olwyn: Russia was absolutely fantastic. And then I've done a lot of cruising. 
Eva: What was nice about Russia? 
Olwyn: Well, to start with, we did it by boat, we were taken to Moscow, and down the river to St. Petersburg. I forget all the places, you'd have to come up to my room and read my travel books. Georgie: Wow. Have you written journals?
Olwyn: I've written all my trips down and I've included all the photos in them. So I've got a whole lot of books about my travels. 
Georgie: Wow.
Eva: That would be lovely. That would be- 
Olwyn: You could come and read them any time you like. 
Eva: Thank you. 
Georgie: Are they by place or by time, how did you organise? 
Olwyn: They're in loose covers. I've typed them out on the computer and put them in loose covers.
Eva: Well, given that you've got so much travel experience, do you have any general travelling advice for those of us who want to do a lot of travelling? 
Olwyn: Um, look, if you're interested in going somewhere, do it. Don't hesitate. The world is a wonderful place. But there's no place left home. Do Australia first and then travel the world. 
Eva: Why Australia 1st? 
Olwyn: Because it's so different. Australia really is so different. They talk about American cowboys, but Australian, what they call them, Roosevelts, ride the horses as well as the cowboys do, round up the cattle. Oh, it's Australia is very interesting. You go to the red centre while you're there, do a balloon ride. 
Eva: That sounds amazing. 
Olwyn: Oh, it's great. Especially- you go out, we went out. Very early in the morning and we saw the sun come up from the Alice and it was absolutely beautiful. 
Eva: Yeah. 
Olwyn: Yeah. 
Georgie: Wow, that's incredible. What kind of advice would you give to your like younger teaching self that- compared to your later teacher self? What would you say?
Olwyn: Well, I have 3 children and none of them have done much travelling. I keep saying to them, you've got to go! But they always make an excuse and they're leaving it too late. Don't leave it too late. Go when you're young and enjoy yourself and see the world. Meet people from other countries! There are- it's an eye opener. You just meet the people, the ordinary people, not the ones that you see on telly, but ordinary families. My husband and I did a trip to America. There was something called a city exchange. And we went to a place in California and had dinner with just an ordinary family. And to talk to them, find out, you know, the differences and the similarities. 
Georgie: Yeah. The good food places! 
Olwyn: And food. Eat the food of the country. Yes, it's very important, mix with the people. See how they live. China was very interesting. We- I was with one, I went on a coach tour, and we were one of the 1st groups from Australia to go into China when China opened their borders to Westerners. Now I'm going back to, it’d have to be the 60s. 
Georgie: Wow
Olwyn: And they were just starting to greet Westerners and the students, particularly men's students, wanted- were learning English, and wanted to talk to somebody. And all the bus people would say, “Oh, go and talk to Olwyn. She's the expert.” So I had lovely conversations. And one of them said to me, “How is it that you can travel without a man looking after you?” 
Georgie: Wow 
Olwyn: Because in China, the man is the ruler of the household, and the wife just comes along behind. But here was a woman travelling by herself, looking after herself, and they just couldn't quite understand that. 
Eva: Weren’t familiar with it. 
Olwyn: I think they might be a bit different now. 
Eva: Yeah, I agree. Did you find a lot of differences between the people themselves and the countries you visited? 
Olwyn: Honestly, there was not a great deal of difference. I mean, they had their own cultures. But in, for example, in Russia, we visited a home and the woman was well educated. She had been a teacher. And her husband was a pilot. So, um, they w- it was just an ordinary family home. With you know family photos around. So there wasn't a great deal of difference, although possibly culturally there would be, but just meeting them one on one. There was no difference. 
Georgie: How about, have you picked up any languages? In your time with speaking with 2nd English speakers? 
Olwyn: Well, I did French and German at school. And I made the mistake once of talking to one of my students who was a German boy, very arrogant and didn't want to learn English. And I spoke to him in German and that was the wrong thing to do. Because then he wanted to just speak German. So after that, I wouldn't speak their language, they had to speak my language because they were in my country. But I think because of the parents, they wanted the children to be Australian. They wanted the children to be well educated, and they realised to be educated they had to learn English first. So, the parents were always very cooperative. Much more so than some of the Australian parents. 
Eva: Really?
Olwyn: Really.
Eva: Is that a cultural thing? 
Olwyn: Yes. I had one boy who said to me, “I don't have to learn anything. I'll just go on the dole like my dad does.” And that was a typical Australian kid in Newcastle. 
Eva: Wow. 
Georgie: What's on- on the dole? Is it a dull? 
Olwyn: That's where they get paid for not going to work. 
Georgie: Oh, it's like an unemployment- yeah, I didn't know that. Wow. That's interesting. 
Eva: Life goal. 
Olwyn: The new Australian children, that wasn't their idea. Their idea was: we're going to earn money, we're going to buy houses, we're going to live well and they did. Um, in Newcastle, I think all the experts in painting houses were non-Australians. Most of them owned their own companies worked hard, beautiful houses. They know- they knew what it was to come from nothing to something and they earned it. And Newcastle was built like that, especially around the Hamilton area where I taught. They worked jolly hard. 
Eva: Is that because they watched their parents-?
Olwyn: Yes-
Eva: Build, build something for them. 
Olwyn: Unfortunately, a lot of them married in their own country, but I know some of them that married Australian girls or some of the girls married Australian men, but um, especially the Greeks wanted the Greeks to marry into the Greek families. Italians were a little bit the same way, but the young ones kicked up their heels and decided not to. And they all since, you know, they're all Australian now. If you look at some of the names of the doctors in Newcastle, you'll find that they have Greek names, Italian names, but they've done well. 
Georgie: On a slightly different topic, did you pick up any hobbies throughout your, like, working life or before? 
Olwyn: Not really. I wasn't- I couldn't draw. I was no good at art, but I read a lot. 
Georgie: I was going to ask you before, did you have any book recommendations? 
Olwyn: Book recommendations. Do you want the ones I read now or the ones I used to read? 
Georgie: Both! 
Eva: Stand outs. 
Georgie: I love books. 
Well, um, when I was growing up, there was a series called the Billabong books. They were about families on the land. Um, I also read um, Pollyanna, Anne of Green Gables, books like that. Now, I read Murder Mysteries. Clive Cussler, Lead Child, who else is one of my favourites. Doesn't matter who they are. I'll read them. We have here the most beautiful library. 
Georgie: Really? 
Olwyn: Yes. 
Georgie: Oh, I haven't been. 
Eva: I didn't know that. 
Olwyn: Up on the 1st floor. You'll have to come one day and come up there and have a look at the extensive library that we have. I think if I live to be 200, I might feel, read all the books. I've read quite a few since I've been here. But I'm not nearly halfway through. 
Georgie: I didn't know that they had such an extensive-
Olwyn: Yes, we've got a fantastic library out there. 
Georgie: Wow. Oh, here's a good one. What lessons did you learn the hard way? 
Olwyn: Lessons. I didn't really think I found any lesson hard. I loved school. I enjoyed it. I did quite well at it, in the leaving certificate, I did biology honours, but I didn't get them. But I got A's in maths and English. 
Georgie: Wow. So... Maths and English. 
Olwyn: Yes, I was quite good at maths and enjoyed English, naturally, becoming an English teacher. 
Eva: That's what I was going to say. That makes the sense if you were good at writing as well since you read so much and you've written a lot about your like travels. 
Olwyn: Oh, yes, yes. I'm very- I'm internet- on the internet most, most days. I'm in the process of writing my autobiography. 
Georgie: Really? 
Eva: Wow. 
Georgie: Can we read it when it's published, please? 
Olwyn: I don't know if I’ll publish it, but I think-
Eva: But you should. 
Georgie: You have to. 
Olwyn: I don't know if I will. My family might publish it after I'd kick the bucket. 
Eva: You should publish it when you- 
Olwyn: But, um, I keep- my son keeps saying to me, “Mum, is that in the book?” When I talk about  something and I have to go back and find the place and put it in the book and that's the joy of the internet. You can go back and put it in, whereas if it were on a typewriter you couldn't do that. 
Eva: Can you tell us a bit about your autobiography? Like how's it structured? Is it just chronological? 
Olwyn: Oh, yes, it's chronological. Yes, yes. 
Eva: What inspired you to write it?
Olwyn: Just to let my great grandchildren know what happened to me. I have 3 children. 9 grandchildren and 12 great grandchildren. 
Eva: Wow. 
Olwyn: And my youngest great grandchild is one month old. 
Eva: Wow. Congratulations. 
Georgie: And about your autobiography. How long ago did you start writing it? 
Olwyn: Quite some time ago, actually. Probably when I was sitting at home thinking, what am I going to do with myself? After I'd retired? I took up bowls, lawn bowls, that is. Um, But I still had plenty of time on my hands, and we had a computer. So I just sat down and started writing. 
Georgie: Wow. That's so interesting actually. It's such a skill too as well. I know writing books is very hard. 
Olwyn: Yes. Um, I know I'm no great writer. I just write it as I think of it. 
Georgie: Comes very naturally to you to be so skilled. 
Olwyn: Yes. Yes. Yes, I had to learn to use the computer because for some reason or other, they put computers in primary schools. And I had to learn how to use it so that I could teach the children. And so I've been using it ever since then, we had our own computer at home, my husband was an accountant, and we had a partnership, bought and sold houses. Many the time I've stood on kitchen benches and scrubbed walls and painted-
Georgie: And you said you had no hobbies!
Eva: It sounds like a second job to me. 
Olwyn: That wasn't a hobby. 
Georgie: You were forced. It was against your will. 
Olwyn: But that's how that's how we made our extra money. Which gave me, you know, chance to live the life that I wanted to live. 
Georgie: Does your husband live here with you? 
Olwyn: No, he died 20 years ago. 
Georgie: Oh, wow. 
Olwyn: Of a heart attack. A massive heart attack. So, um, so no, I've been by myself for, for some time. But, but I've got family. 
Eva: A lot!
Olwyn: I've got a daughter  that looks after me. She lives close. A son that visits me every week and we go out to lunch. 
Georgie: Wow. 
Olwyn: And I have to email my family in the morning that I'm up and about so that they know I haven't kicked the bucket. And if I- if I don't do it quickly enough, my son will ring and say, “Mum, you haven't emailed me.”
Eva: That's very anxious. 
Georgie: That's lovely. That's, yeah, that's a great thing. Would you say that like family is a very important value to you? 
Olwyn: Oh, they are the most important thing in the world. I've done my family history. I've done my husband's family history as much as I can without him. But to me, my son and 2 daughters are very, very important. I've got 2 lovely sons in law. Very different, ones English, the others a motorbike rider. When Kerry brought him down for the 1st time, he came into the house, he was all in leathers, leather pants, leather jacket, with a one of those chains over his shoulder, and a moustache. Down here. His nickname was Turk. And I thought, good heavens, what my daughter got me into here. But he's a pussycat. He's a lovely man. He was a policeman. But oh, he's a lovely man. As I say, I've got 2 lovely sons in-law. And so as I say, grandchildren, great grandchildren. Family is the most important thing in anyone's life. 
Georgie: Wow. I love that you have such a strong connection to your family. That's really nice 
Olwyn: Yes. 
Georgie: Going back to maybe early in your life, was there ever a fork in the road where you had to make a really tough choice and how did you get to that answer? 
Olwyn: Tough choice. Not really. I was always very definite in what I wanted to do. I think, even as a little girl, I must have been thinking about school teaching, because I used to teach my dolls, when I learned at school that day, when I was little. It was just a matter of what I could achieve myself because we had, we had very little money. We lived in what's known as a blue collar area, which is a working man's area. As I say, my father died when I was 5. My mother remarried, and I have a half-sister, um, who's very precious to me. And, but, everything that I've got, I've earned myself. There was no money, no inheritance or anything like that. It was all jolly hard work. 
Georgie: Wow. 
Olwyn: There was only one time where, yes, I did come to a fork in the road, I really wanted to go into the diplomatic service, but I didn't get a good enough score in the higher school certificate to go that way. I had to take the teacher's college way. Because they paid us to go to college. So that was the easy way out, really. But I would have liked to have got into the diplomatic service. I think I might have made a good diplomat. 
Georgie: I think you would have too. That's so interesting. You mentioned before, not feeling as though you had earned like everything that you have in your life. I think a lot of women specifically suffer with like imposter syndrome, feeling as though they didn't earn that, even though they did the hard work, what would you say to those people who feel that way? 
Olwyn: Whatever you have now, you have earned, if you haven't earned it, it's not worth it. You have to work for anything that you really want. Strive for the stars. Do as well as you can, uh, be as good as you can. Use your abilities to the best of your ability. And that's about it. 
Eva: Yeah. Does it feel a lot more rewarding that you've worked really hard and like independently for all the things that you've achieved? 
Olwyn: Oh, yes, yes. I keep telling my family that they, they'll have to have it now or, or it'll be gone before- I'm spreading my wealth before I go. I've just spent quite a lot of money on my daughter's new kitchen, my other daughter's bathroom and en suite, whatever I give to what I give to the other. Yeah. All my- all my family get money for their birthdays and Christmas because I'm not going to go around and buy a present that probably wouldn't be appreciated anyway. So, yes, I was so spread my money abound. 
Georgie: Um, I wanted to ask before. What would you say was something that you were most proud of throughout your life?
Olwyn: What was that? 
Georgie: What was something that you're most proud of? 
Olwyn: Telling my French teacher off. 
Eva: Tell us about that. 
Georgie: Why didn't you lead with this story? 
Olwyn: No, I contradicted her. And she didn't like being contradicted. So I was put out of the room for the rest of the lesson. 
Georgie: What did you say? 
Olwyn: I've always believed in speaking the truth. And if someone says something that's horribly wrong, sometimes I can't help myself to contradict them. So that's probably the worst part of me. 
Eva: No, that sounds like-. That sounds like an amazing quality. It's strong, yeah. Can you think of another time in your life where you've had to do that where you've had to contradict people in your life? 
Olwyn: Um, well, as I say, I contradicted to the infant's mistress when she called the staff and Mrs. Jones. 
Eva: Oh, yeah. 
Olwyn: And when I was teaching the Junction Demonstrations School in Newcastle, the headmistress didn't like me very much because I used to speak my mind and she was not used to people doing that to her. Her name, if you leave the A out of her name, which was Leaman, you'll know what she was like. 
Eva: How do you spell it? 
Olwyn: L-E-A-M-O-N. Leave the A out. 
Georgie: Oh, lemon. 
Eva: Ohhhh
Georgie: Lemon.
Olwyn: That's what she was like. As in a school, you're supposed to be there at a certain time. And I happened to live 2 bus trips away from where the school was. And if the buses didn't coordinate, I would be late. So, at the time, a red line would be drawn across the page, you would have to sign below the line if you were late. However, If the sewing teacher happened to be on the same bus as me and she was late too. There was never a red line because Betty was a favourite. 
Eva: Wow. 
Olwyn: And it showed. 
Georgie: Wow. 
Olwyn: She showed it quite clearly. 
Georgie: I wonder why. That's so peculiar. 
Olwyn: I don't know why, but anyway, that's what happened. But I was glad to get away from her. I had a couple of different episodes of different teaching in different schools, but I enjoyed it all. 
Georgie: Is there any last advice that you'd want to like tell young people of today that you'd tell a younger version of yourself or just even us? 
Olwyn: Strive the stars, do as best you can, if an opportunity comes grab it! 
Georgie: And that's all for us today. Thank you so, so much for listening and make sure to check out our website where you can find the transcript and all of our episodes to come. 
Eva: Quick shout out to our wonderful team, Shyan for all of our editing, Zara for all her organisation behind the scenes, and my co-host for today, Georgie. 
Eva and Georgie: With Love from Bougainvillea, mwah!